Difference between HAI "LED/CFL" Dimmer and non-LED/CFL?

[pgray007]

Anyone know the difference between the 35A00-1CFL and 35A00-1, other than an extra $20 for the former?
 
We have a mix of LED and incandescent (no CFL) and are gradually migrating to LED. I'd go for the LED switch but at $80 versus $60 that's a 25% additional charge.
 
Will the non-CFL version have any problems with Philips "dimmable" LED flood bulbs, or is there any other reason to pony up the extra money for the CFL version?

 

[tmbrown97]

I don't know with certainty, but I *thought* the difference was being able to set the cutoff limits closer to what the LED bulbs like.  I can say though, I use all sorts of dimmable LED lights with my Simply Automated UPB switches and have had no issues whatsoever other than those just inherent with LED lights.

 

[ano]

The LED/CFL dimmer has several features geared to LED and CFL bulbs.  First, it is designed to control lights that only use a small amount of wattage without flickering. Second the lighting curve is designed to match LED bulbs and not incandescent bulbs.  For example if you set a regular dimmer to 50%, that works fine for incandescent bulbs but an LED bulb with the same dimmer would be at 90%. The LED dimmer keeps the bulb nearer to the correct brightness. Finally HAI has tested many CFL and LED bulbs with this dimmer, so that helps you know what works.
 
I've had an a regular UPB dimmer work with many LED bulbs, especially when you many on one branch, but I've also has some not work well.  The LED dimmer gives you a better shot at getting it to work correctly, but you might want to try a regular one first if your concerned by the price difference.

 

[jmorris644]

I have over 70 of the non-LED (3500A-1) version of these switches. I just changed out some incandescent bulbs and replaced them with LED dimmable bulbs. I am getting flickers and poor dimming capabilities.
 
As I move forward with changing the incandescent to LED is there anything I can do short of changing out all of my switches?
 
Thanks
 
Joe

 

[az1324]

Find a specific LED bulb that performs adequately.

 

[rsw686]

I bought all 35A00-1CFL dimmers. The modified dimming curve works great for CFLs, but is annonying for LED or incandescent bulbs. Moving the dimmer to 90% takes away 30% of the bulb brightness. I had to change the dimming rate to 6 seconds so I can more acurately control the light level. They also have a minimum level setting to prevent the CFL bulb from turning off when dimming to a low level. I still debate whether I should have just bought the 35A00-1 dimmers. However I haven't used one so I can't comment on how well they work.

 

[jmorris644]

I think that the current state of these switches is frustrating. I can verify that the 35A00-1 does not work at all in regards to dimming CFL. The CFL is either on or off. No in-between. I have not played with the dimming rate when trying LED bulbs. I will have to do that.
 
So far I have tried 4 different manufacturers' bulbs with the 35A00-1 switches with no winners yet. All of the LED bulbs that I have tried state that they are dimmable but they all flicker.
 
Joe

 

[kurtmccaslin]

Good discussion.   I am building a house using a lot of LED lighting and I was not aware of the issues. 
 
I have been using a Web Mountain plug in UPB dimmer in my current house for a couple of lamps with LED bulbs.   They dim to about half and then shut off.   Not optimal, but I dont have the flicker problem.
 
I also have questions about how many LED bulbs you can put on the 300 watt rated CFL/LED dimmer.   According to the CREE website, you need to derate the dimmers due to the high inrush current when you turn the LED on.   They recommend using approximately the incandescent equivalent wattage.   (therefore a 10 watt LED bulb will use up around 60 watts in the dimmer.)   Does this mean that I can use 5- 10 watt LED bulbs on a dimmer?   Or is it 30?

 

[jmorris644]

I believe the switches are rated at 600W.
 
Joe

 

[Desert_AIP]

Dimmable CFLs are spotty to say the least.
 
LEDs dim well.  Cree CR6 are great through a nearly full range of dimming.

 

[kurtmccaslin]

You are right.   They are 600 watts.   I got the 300w from the Amazon site.   Must be mis labeled.
 
I still wonder if you need to derate the capacity when handling LED lighting.   I found the following on the Cree website:
 
* The CR Series LED Downlights are designed to be dimmed with standard incandescent type dimmers, and are also compatible with most Magnetic Low Voltage (MLV) and Electronic Low Voltage (ELV) type dimmers. Due to an electronic characteristic known as Repetitive Peak Current, which results from inrush current at the phase cut, Cree downlights should be treated as a 75W load for sizing purposes when used with dimmers. In situations where there are multiple dimming circuits sharing the same breaker feed, ELV dimmers should be used.
 
I could not find anything in the Leviton instructions regarding this inrush current.

 

[az1324]

Most things I have seen recommend only 120-150W of LEDs for a 600W dimmer.

 

[e2djonline]

I have tested HAI switches both the 35A00-1 and 35A00-1CFL. I am using 2 Sylvania LED par 30s. From my tests the non CFL dimmer (35A00-1) works better. The 35A00-1CFL was terrible. The flicker was unacceptable. I ended up putting a Lutron RA2 system in instead. The RRD-6NA is great for dimming LEDs from my experience. I would have loved to go with UPB just because the price point and easy HAI integration, but in the end Lutron seems to be the best fit for LED dimming at this time. 

 

[ano]

I have mainly Simply Automated switches, even early version ones, and they seem to dim most LED lights pretty good. I've also had good luck with Cree LR6 lights, but was getting occasional flicker. I fixed it by placing a 3 micro farad 200V AC capacitor across one of the lights.  Another option I have tried is to use one 60w incandescent on the circuit.
 
If you love CFLs, and want dimming, there is a type that dims fantastically with most dimmers. They are called "cold cathode" and you have to search for them. In my bathroom I have they typical builder 10 or 12 globe lights above the mirror. I replaced them all with cold cathode fluorescent. They dim as good as if not better than incandescents and they last forever just about. But they are a bit pricey and their size typically only get to 8 Watts (40 Watt equivalent).  I'm not sure why they aren't talked about more, they are close to the efficiency of LEDs, and they dim like there is no tomorrow. Check them out if you want a very efficient, very long-life, very dimmable bulb.

 

[BLH]

I have not see too many LED bulb manufacturers state the Inrush Current and Reprieve Peak Current calculations. In their sales literature. Many times it is buried in one of their specifications sheets or tested dimmers they work with.
 
I have a Sylvania that said use 80 watts per bulb to compensate for In Rush Current when calculating the load on a dimmer.
 
I found a white paper on In Rush Current and Repetitive Peak Current.
http://www.lrc.rpi.edu/programs/solidstate/assist/pdf/ASSIST-TechNote-Dimming-InrushCurrent.pdf