Wired or Z wave Thermostats

[gdking74]

Ive turned on the Elk for the first time, and everything seems to be working ok. Now onto the next step - thermostats.

This was new construction - so I have (2) Cat 5's and (1) 18/2 pulled to (2) thermostat locations. (1) location each for (2) zones - an upstairs and a downstairs. And I already have the M1XZW to control future lights; I still have yet to buy the switches.

My question is - should I go with a wired thermostat or a Z-wave thermostat.

If costs were about the same (and considering that I have to spend another $60 - $70 for a serial port expander - I think that cost will be a wash for the two thermostats), are there benefits to having them hardwired to the Elk M1Gold or controlling them with via Z-wave.

I dont need remote sensing, just control over a basic heat pump system in a relatively new bi-level condo. Ease of install would be great - I just dont know if there are inherent and significant differences that Im not aware of that would make wired thermostats more accurate or better in some way over a Z-wave thermostat.

My wired choice would be the Omnistat 2.
Wireless would be the TZ43 or some derivative of it: Trane Schlage.


Thanks for your input, this site has been invaluable.

 

[tmbrown97]

I don't believe the Elk supports any ZWave thermostats just yet... so if you already have the Cat 5 there, I'd go with the Omnistat 2 - and keep in mind, you'll need an XSP to hook it to (only one will support both tstats).

 

[Winter]

I've been working with two Zwave Stat's and can't get any of them to work. One is the TZ43 and the other is 2GIG's CT30.
I did have some functionality with the TZ43 but not total control. Spoke with ELK but they seem to have no clue with thermostats.
I've also searched all over the forums but no luck.
With the CT30 you can integrate to your local network and do the IP connectivity, I haven't looked into this but its worth checking.

If any of you have any luck with the Zwave thing please leave something. I have been to the end of the internet and found nothing.

Happy holidays

 

[Digger]

Just this weekend I put an Intermatic CA8900 T-Stat on the bench. I connected an M1XSP with the Leviton VRCOP to the ELK. I was able to get T-Stat talking to the ELK but I can not get the 2 way yet to display the actual temp in RMS or eKeypad.

There is a setup procedure with the Leviton RZCPG-SG Remote to get the two way status to work:

Main Menu
then
System
then
Advanced
then
RS-232
then
Setup

after teh above you need to cycle the power on the ELK.

The only problem is I do not see the "RS-232" in the Advanced screen. I need to play with it some more to figure it out.

 

[gdking74]

Work2play: I had talked to automated outlet and they suggested the tz43 and that it was indeed compatible with the elk (but I don't know specifically how). I ended up buying the omnistat.

 

[twilo123]

we added zwave tstats in our iphone app here Total Control Z-Wave Automation Edition. We support them through the leviton serial controllers also. As far as i remember there is no auto update via the serial controller. There are only direct command acknowledgments and polling. So in our case we utilize command ack as well as polling right after commands and on a polling cycle to keep things updated and current in the app GUI. maybe it is similar in Elk.

 

[Digger]

I have spoken to Automated Outlet and they also told me that they have set up 2 way status on Zwave T-Stats if you use the VRCOP and the RZCPG-SG remote. I believe they said they have done this with several brands of T-Stats. Apparently you HAVE to HAVE the RZCPG-SG remote to set up the two way RS232 Communications between the VRCOP and the ELK. I am sure that they are correct I just need to spend a little more time with it.

I will try and work on this over the weekend.

In my opinion UPB is sooooooo much easier to setup then Zwave. But I have found out that a VRCOP in the basement seems to reach my whole house signal wise which is important as I will only have 2 or 3 Zwave devices (at first at least).

 

[intozwave]

On the VRCPG-SG make sure you are running at least the 2.4 firmware on the remote - current version is 2.5

 

[Odeen]

For what it's worth, Radio Shack has ALL of their Z-Wave gear (including the Trane Z-wave thermostat) on sale at 50% off through the end of the day today.

The Trane thermostat is $74.99 + tax, and free shipping. There's also a $10 off $40 coupon available, but I haven't been able to get it to work online.

 

[Winter]

I have the older VRCPG-BSG and it don't work for sure. I have done some work with the controlthink usb stick and communications with everything seems to work well.
Some research I found on the VRCOP is that it don't support Beaming. This is something I'm not very familiar with. On the Leviton site they mention coming out with a new VRCOP sometime next year.
Anyone heard of this and any fact to this?
The CT-30 thermostat from radio thermostat seems to be very nice. The CT-30 is capable of everything the RCS TZ43 plus will do wireless IP (wifi).
As for the ELK M1. This seems to be an issue. I have yet to control the Thermostats from the Keypad or the Browser.
Basically worthless.
I do have faith in the Z-wave products but may need another solution as far as integration.

 

[intozwave]

Since you have the controlthink stick you can update the VRCPG-BSG to firmware 2.5 here is the Link to the Leviton page with the firmware B)

 

[Winter]

Thanks for the tip on the update but the VRCPG-BSG I have don't have the boot loader option. Version 1.1P has to be sent back to have the update installed.
I'll have to order a new one. Not surprising, but getting to be expensive.

 

[etc6849]

Can anyone verify that you can have two way status feedback using a zwave thermostat (i.e. a manual change on the thermostat is automatically sent to the VRC0P eliminating the need for polling)?

I'm very surprised at some of the comments here indicating that this is possible... I currently use two Trane zwave thermostats with a VRC0P and a ControlThink Think Stick; no two way feedback for thermostats, only lighting. Right now I have polling set up and poll the thermostats every 30 seconds to get status updates...

As far as my understanding goes, the two way status feedback is a Leviton added feature, not part of the zensys protocol; that is why you need vizia rf/rf+ lights to get two way status feedback. I would love to get it working for thermostats.

I do use a M1G, but the VRC0P is used through Premise (a free PC based HA program). Premise receives any motion triggered by the M1G, then triggers lights etc... If you can't get the thermostats working with the M1G, why not set up Premise on a PC and use the VRC0P along with your M1G?...

http://www.cocoontech.com/wiki/Premise
http://www.cocoontech.com/forums/index.php?showforum=51

 

[Winter]

I haven't gotten to use the two way switches yet. I do like the Leviton switches best, they seem to stay functional. I have other brands but they have distance problems and seem to burn out.
with this said the switches I'm using are 2 or 3 years old. The Leviton switches have never failed.

I'm looking at the Premise stuff and it is very nice. I would like to stay away from a PC based system and use the M1G as the control.
To many issues with a PC.

gdking74: How did your project workout?

 

[etc6849]

I know what you're saying about the PC part. Premise is very stable and can run for many years on a dedicated computer without a reboot. The two way feedback is neat since I also use it to trigger occupancy if someone toggles a switch manually. Using two way feedback an occupancy timer is set to turn the lights off after 10 minutes unless motion, a door sensor or another light switch is triggered within the same room. The system works seamlessly with the Elk using 123's M1G module that he was nice enough to post.

I'm sure the two way feedback can work on the M1G if you use the serial expander with the VRC0P/RZC0P firmware; I haven't tried it yet. I wonder if the Elk option supports scenes/groups?