Has CQC left the DIY market?

[icellama21]

It has been a while since I've looked to license CQC, usually working on someone else's license. I went to the website today and alas, couldn't find any link to a DIY product. Has CQC gone over to the dark("Pro" Only) side or am I missing something. I definitely remember an entire section of the website dedicated to explaining the difference between DIY and integrator with pricing for both. Thanks!

PS: What is the current price? I know there were some specials in the fall, but what is the license selling for now.

Copied from the Charmed Quark website ... Is this really true:

The vast majority of CQC customers will obtain CQC within the context of a professionally installed automation solution. They will contract one of our Integration Partners or Resellers to design, install, and configure a CQC based solution for them, and the purchase of CQC will be included within the overall price of that solution, and will not be purchased directly from Charmed Quark Systems.

Only Charmed Quark Systems' Integration Partners, or installers who work with our Reseller Partners, are authorized to install CQC. They will have the support required to insure that your solution is successful and robust. Charmed Quark will not support or honor any professional installations that are not performed by our Integration Partners or Resellers' affiliated installers. Use the Links menu item above for a list of available partners.

 

[Deane Johnson]

I can't answer your question, but I will add that when I was recently searching for a software system my reading from their site was that they were not DIY friendly in the least. As a result, I removed them from my list as a possibility.

 

[icellama21]

I'll wait for a response from whomever is in the know as I am curious. But for now the website has cost at least one sale, I need to get something done ASAP so I'm off to use J9 which is plenty good enough for most things, but not quite as complete.

 

[sic0048]

CQC is still very DIY friendly. I'm surprised anyone that is active here would even think otherwise with as many CQC DIYers as we have on this forum.

That being said, email Dean directly for information on a DIY license: [email protected]

 

[icellama21]

I always believed CQC was very DIY-friendly, and I was able to find a lot of information here and on the charmed quark forum in the past.

That being said, it is a bit scary when someone intentionally removes all DIY references from their website, esp considering how prominent it used to be. Makes me wonder what direction the product is going. I can't imagine many "typical" customers look at their website. There isn't even a link to email for info on a DIY license, at least not one I could find. Makes me leery of developing a system on it that I may have difficulty updating or maintaining in the future. I'd just like to see a sign of continuing support from Dean, thats all. The product is excellent.

 

[dgeffs]

CQC is probably the most DIY friendly product I've ever owned. Deans responses in the CQC Forum are nearly instantaneous and since the information comes from the developer it's exactly what you need to solve any problem. I don't know how he keeps up with all the questions and has any time to work on future versions. But the product is always moving forward and is a bargain at twice the price. I can't imagine using anything more versatile and complete or with better support.

Even though I've barely scratched the surface of what I can do with CQC I'm thrilled with what I've developed so far. It is a PRO product with a DIY price point. He may have lost your sale but others need to understand how good this product is and how really, really helpful the DIY support is.

Dale

 

[123]

... Makes me leery of developing a system on it that I may have difficulty updating or maintaining in the future. ..

I live dangerously and use an HA product that was shelved several years ago. I've used Premise for two years and its 'defunct' status hasn't proved to be a problem. It still does what it was designed to do and its programmability allows it to be adapted to changing technologies.

I'd be very surprised to learn that Dean intends to abandon the DIY market ... but even if that happened, CQC is currently a very capable product and will continue to retain its value for years to come.

PS
If anyone wants to start a hot rumor, this topic's title certainly has the right stuff ...

 

[electron]

The site has been like that for a while. Dean doesn't want to upset the installers/dealers, and technically, the DIY market is NOT supported, but he does go out of his way to add features/resolve bugs the second people report them. That combined with the CQC forum members makes it a very solid DIY choice IMO.

 

[sic0048]

The site has been like that for a while. Dean doesn't want to upset the installers/dealers, and technically, the DIY market is NOT supported, but he does go out of his way to add features/resolve bugs the second people report them. That combined with the CQC forum members makes it a very solid DIY choice IMO.

That is exactly right. Dean has told me this himself.

icellama21 - I have to respecfully disagree with your statment that most prospective customers would not look at the CQC website. I'd be surprised if a prospective DIDN'T look at the CQC site. Those individuals are about to spend a lot of money and I guarantee you they do their research before pulling the trigger.

In order to prevent the undoubtably tough conversation with a customer who sees a DIY price on the website but has been quoted another price, Dean has decided to take references to the DIY pricing off the site. I completely understand. The DIY license and the Integrator license are very different in terms of support. Basically the DIY license has no official support from Dean and Mark - hence the difference in price. The normal CQC license price is extremely fair for integrators that need support and will be providing support to their clients, but there is a price for that level of support. While the software itself is the same, it is the service level that determines the difference in price.

Removing the DIY reference on the web site is not an indication that CQC is doing poorly as some have suggested. In fact, I think it clearly shows that CQC is growing in popularity with professional integrators. Dean is not going to run the risk of loosing professional jobs because of the DIY language on the web site. He would rather loose the potential DIYer that simply doesn't know about it, than loose a profession job because a potential customer is angry about the lower DIY price when they don't understand the difference in support levels between the two models.

 

[icellama21]

I really didn't want to start a debate about the merits of CQC for a DIY, I guess I was just hoping for a sign of support. It is pretty easy to use the existing videos, forums and resources to get going with CQC. I was never expecting to get direct technical support, just a guarantee that I could purchase licenses for a reasonable rate without having to deal with an integrator.

As for the entire argument about buyer's "sticker shock" compared to a DIY product, I am not sure it is valid. If this is really the reason, it sounds a bit like some integrators are trying to pull a mattress salesman trick and hide product and cost transparency. I also respect that many tradesmen need to work for what seems like exorbidant hourly rates, but in reality it is the cost structure of the business, not the hours that matter. I think the average buyer is familiar with this. I just paid a plumber/mechanic/doctor $300 for 20 minutes of work, but hey, I can buy a snake/engine seal/suture kit for $40.

I suspect the problem comes when someone starts charging $10000 for a days work or the buyer is not well informed about the complexity of the system. It doesn't seem logical to delete a large amound of DIY info from the website to solve these problems. Maybe take the price away and provide an email link, but no reference at all to the DIY possibility doesn't seem constructive. That is my 2 cents.

 

[AnthonyZ]

I really didn't want to start a debate about the merits of CQC for a DIY, I guess I was just hoping for a sign of support. It is pretty easy to use the existing videos, forums and resources to get going with CQC. I was never expecting to get direct technical support, just a guarantee that I could purchase licenses for a reasonable rate without having to deal with an integrator.

As for the entire argument about buyer's "sticker shock" compared to a DIY product, I am not sure it is valid. If this is really the reason, it sounds a bit like some integrators are trying to pull a mattress salesman trick and hide product and cost transparency. I also respect that many tradesmen need to work for what seems like exorbidant hourly rates, but in reality it is the cost structure of the business, not the hours that matter. I think the average buyer is familiar with this. I just paid a plumber/mechanic/doctor $300 for 20 minutes of work, but hey, I can buy a snake/engine seal/suture kit for $40.

I suspect the problem comes when someone starts charging $10000 for a days work or the buyer is not well informed about the complexity of the system. It doesn't seem logical to delete a large amound of DIY info from the website to solve these problems. Maybe take the price away and provide an email link, but no reference at all to the DIY possibility doesn't seem constructive. That is my 2 cents.

You simply don't understand the biz model in place. I know because I've been there, reselling CQC. The fact is that as an integrator I do not get the license at the DIY price. Instead, the professionals purchase the license at a MUCH, MUCH, MUCH steeper price and then can resell with or without a mark up. Since I know for an absolute fact that potential clients have (thus do) look at the CQC website when receiving their estimate, the removal of the DIY license (which contractually can NOT be worked on by an integration partner) was necessary. That's why the DIY price is gone. As stated, you can contact Dean via email and get the ball rolling.

 

[ano]

CQC is a professional product, and it makes perfect sense for Dean to remove the DIY references from the web site. There is no question that professional installers pay most of the bills for CQC, and that it how it should be, but at the same token, Dean smartly users DIY users/beta testers to his advantage, like he should. They/we test new releases, provide feedback, ideas, etc. and assure that CQC remains the stable innovative products that professional purchasers of the product expect. For this assistance Dean offers DIY users/testers a discount, which also makes sense, since its these people that really assist with making CQC what it is today.

So, DIY/beta testers should not expect to purchase CQC at a fraction of what professionally installed purchasers purchase it for, and still receive the same support as these users receive. At the same token, Dean has not changed his DIY stance, that I know of, and still heavily relies on DIY users to help test the product and offer enhancement ideas, and for that relationship, CQC sells the product to these users at a lower price. If your not willing to work within these bounds, than a CQC DIY license is probably not for you.

As others have stated, Dean always helps everyone on the board with problems and bug fixes, as its in his best interest to do that. With any luck DIY users will find and report bugs before they are found in professionally installed systems, and that type of testing allows professionally installed users to get a higher quality system then they would have otherwise, and because of that, they pay a higher price for the product.

 

[mustangcoupe]

CQC License can be purchased from Automated Outlet

http://www.automatedoutlet.com/Home/CQC-EUV

CQC-EUV

Charmed Quark System's automation products provide robust, flexible, and cost effective control of lighting, HVAC, security, home theater, media data, and other systems. It is available in various configurations, which will scale to meet your needs, whether large or small, open or secure, a single room or the whole home.

What You are Buying

When we receive the order confirmation of your purchase, we will e-mail you a license file. Save the license file to your local drive and then use the Register button, on the registration dialog box that comes up any time you run a CQC GUI program in trial mode, to select that file and upload it. Once you have uploaded the license file, reboot the machine running the CQC Master Server and your system will become licensed for the options you've purchased.

* Note that Integration Partners are not licensed to provide their services to customers who have purchased the End User version of this product, so please don't ask them to do so. You may upgrade your system to the integrator's version by paying the difference between the cost of your existing End User license and the integrator license.
* Customers who buy the End User version and pay a non-Integration Partner to install it, will void all obligations of Charmed Quark Systems to the customer, including the obligation to license any future versions. So please do not do this. It is a clear abuse of our attempt to provide an inexpensive version to the End User community.

Maintenance Fees

The purchase of this CQC license includes a $95 yearly maintenance fee, owed each year on the anniversary of your purchase. This fee covers all upgrades and most new components that might be added during that year. The first year's fee is included in the sale price.

 

[Dean Roddey]

The correct answer was given above. We do still sell a DIY version. We do it informally these days. Though the number of DIY customers who are interested in as high end a product as ours is very small, and you'd think it wouldn't be an issue, it makes pro installers uneasy, so we don't really advertise it. The problem is not the installers themselves, but they know perfectly well what happens when they are spec'ing any piece of equipment and the customer goes out on the internet and finds it for a lower price and the arguments that ensue. Of course the difference is that the razor thin marjin store that's selling it for the rock bottom price probably isn't going to even answer your calls if there's a problem, whereas the installer is creating a complete system for you and has to support not just it, but it within the context of a large and complicated automation solution. But, nonetheless, that argument always occurs, so they prefer we don't advertise it.

If you are interested just contact us at [email protected] and we can do it on an informal basis. Of course, absolute worst case, if we did have to stop selling to DIYers some day, any existing customers would be unaffected by that.

The Automated Outlet thing above is not true anymore.

 

[mustangcoupe]

The Automated Outlet thing above is not true anymore.

Does this statement mean they are not authorized to sell it anymore? If so I pulled that information off their website just to answer the question and they need to remove the product from their web store.